Interesting Reading...

[old_eastender]

26 minutes ago, Benjam!n Ultra said:

The sooner the Johnson mafia's influence over this club ends the better.

I'll go with the 'no smoke without fire' view on the OP post, but whatever the truth the above is absolutely correct.

#Johnsonoutnow

[Kid in the Riot]

9 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

More I read - it looks like a hash up of some of the stuff that has appeared on here from all sorts of places

Djb did post on here and was always very diplomatic / discreet  when he was undoubtedly in a position to reveal all sorts of behind the scenes

Ive spoken to him a number of times about Wes's welfare / progress and he keeps his opinions on every other thing to himself keeping his posts to Wes  

In fairness it's clever as it tends to give the post credence

Im anything but a LJ fan but even I can't see him quoting his Father to players and that destroys the credibility of the post in all honesty

You're wrong on that last para mate.

I'm sure Mr B will be along to confirm he didn't write it, if that's the case.

[The Dolman Pragmatist]

10 hours ago, Bobfish said:

A lot of this fits a lot of circumstantial evidence. I remember when LJ first joined as head coach GJ did an interview where he pointly said that LJ would "be more likely to ask his mother for help than me, he is his own man." Yet I remember a radio Bristol interview with LJ who said he and his dad watch all their games back together to talk them through. Not to mention how our U23's is a feeder club for Gj's. And I remember GJ being the commentator for a cup match on radio Bristol, maybe hull, when GJ slated Engvall throughout. In the post match interview LJ sang Engvall’s praises, yet Engvall wasn’t seen, except collecting splinters, for weeks, perhaps after LJ discussed what to do with his dad.

If the letter above is wes’s dad then he is clearly being protective of his son, yet to me calling SC arrogant etc makes this all the more plausible.

Pieces of the puzzle…..I remember people in the crowd and even the opposition manager tweeting about Tomlin’s disgusting language to LJ at Huddersfield?, back just before his first start for us on the bench. Then there is more, our massive drop in form, LJ himself talking about players “he can trust,” players disappearing for weeks at a time, Jens being the latest. I would not be surprised if someone who played, and scored, in the champions’ league was not amused by some of the antics of our napoleon. So much more, the fact LJ is still in his job after such a terrible sequence of results speaks volumes in itself. Not to mention in an interview yesterday he talked about how it was a joint decision to remove pembo, distancing himself, when mark ashton today said how LJ had planned to remove pembo by the end of the season. Even in interviews when on his best behaviour LJ’s spiteful comments come through, Tomlin driving back home effecting his fitness, adam matthews not being a professional, too much cola etc. Players being “naive” (ironic). And how often has he talked about not knowing whether to slap or cuddle the players? The reported incident that led to gary o’neil going to the board when LJ told staff and players not involved in a game to get out of the changing rooms before going mental at those that remained. Maybe all this is made up, but what about the patterns of players being dropped completely for games after these reported incidents, like o’neil and his “niggly” injuries (o’neils words in recent interview), exactly the same words Tomlin used in his “everything is fine” interview about his own non-selection due to “niggly injuries”. These interviews are always a little too convient. And they always talk about how great the team spirit is etc, the “family”. Take the recent pembo thing as well, perhaps the talk of him grabbing Tomlin’s throat is nonsense, but why would pembo, who don’t forget was Tomlin’s coach at Peterborough too so go way back, do this? If Tomlin does hate LJ, which is obvious, then perhaps he did miss that penalty on purpose? Pembo may have been in no doubt of this and as pembo loves/loved the club maybe he did act more aggressively than he should. A caller on RB after the game even said that Tomlin must hate LJ lots by the way he missed that penalty, not even taking a proper run up. 

I am a scientist and know that individually the above can be discounted, lack of evidence etc, but there is a hell of a picture there when it is all put together. And I am sure there are plenty of other similar ones I have missed. And the most obvious point of all is how terrible we are on the pitch. The players ain’t happy. The fans aren’t, but the club is always quick to put music on as soon as half time/full time happens to try and hide the boos, no doubt to be followed with another interview mentioning “unity.”

 

And I must say, I am starting to think some of the posters here defend LJ so quickly that they may get paid by the message. And this is from someone who supported LJ for months and only started to turn after the second Cardiff game.

If much of this was true, I'd be as concerned as you are.  Certainly, my 'defence' of LJ - if it is seen as that - has been more to do with the club than LJ as an individual.  I don't like to see Steve Lansdown abused, and I get frustrated when what seem sensible decision by LJ get slated simply because it is him who made them - and also the lack of consistency from some posters on here - but there is nothing I would be more concerned about than bad man management.  Of course football must be a nightmare in that respect - all those competing egos and ambitions - but the one thing I would not tolerate is a bully.

I don't want to insult anyone on here, but the notion of a 'Napoleon complex' or 'short man syndrome' has been debated widely elsewhere, and has been the subject of scholarly articles (see this regarding my own University http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/science-news/10603195/Short-man-syndrome-really-does-exist-Oxford-University-finds.html).  I think signing Tomlin was always going to be a gamble in terms of the potential for him to destabilize the morale of the squad, and we saw exactly that with Djiekanowski, so I have some sympathy there, but you have to take people with you, or you are lost.  I find all this deeply concerning.

 

 

[Alessandro]

9 hours ago, NickJ said:

If I knew that I would have said, wouldn't I.

As I said, Lansdown has either:

1) Lost the plot or

2) a sinister reason to keep Johnson on the payroll.

The third possibility which I personally discount is that Lansdown's judgment is sound.

Which of the three do think?

 

9 hours ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Or just stubborn and not wanting to lose face Nick ?

Playing Russian roulette over relegation / saving face ???

I think your answer is in MA's interview. 

We are in a relegation fight and the way the club are dealing with it is to stay together, unified.

From inside the club, its Unity. Admirable.

From outside it's stubbornness or losing the plot. Abominable.

The club are staying unified because they think they can keep us up. I don't think that is sinister. Is it the right choice? We will find out in May. Then we will be met with a whole new set of questions if we go down or stay up.

I've said already I think LJ should be unemployed right now. SL is playing one hell of a game of Russian roulette here with the club - it's hell for the fans because we feel like we are being forced to play too, but that's being a football 'fan' these days.

Clearly there has been some fallout this season behind the scenes at times, but I think, although some rumours on OTIB are no doubt close to the truth - this last half a season has reached new heights of hysteria at times. Some very believable fake news. And some real news that has no doubt been exaggerated on OTIB by the vacuum of real information and frustration at our current position.

As for this OP? As @BobBobSuperBob Lots of stuff that could have been gleaned from OTIB and then perhaps embellished. Or maybe a bitter rant from Wes' father? I've also spoken to him and he always seems more eloquent than the OP - plus I'm 99% that although he is a director of a company, it isn't a £450m one.

[Kid in the Riot]

46 minutes ago, cityboy said:

Stopped reading when it stated signing Callum was poor business.

What a load of tosh. Still, people will believe what they want to believe.

That's HIS opinion. Other opinions are available!

[Mr Popodopolous]

12 hours ago, Nibor said:

The make believe printout someone photographed and put on twitter.

See here.

Have to say those figures look very suspect, for the simple reason that our wage bill last season (and I don't know what % of it is non playing staff) was in excess of £13m! (That does not include social security, or pension or directors pay either).

The rest of the account sounds very interesting in OP but the wage bill seems crazily low.

[TETBURY MASSIVE]

[simon uk]

Just read through this, if the post is from wes's dad, he has a natural bias towards his son, and presumably, his son is his source of information, and wes may also have been biased based on perceived lack of game time. 

A few observations, re engvall, i would take the mark hughes quite that he was a good young player, over a peeved off dads opinion... the lad played for gothenburg, and sweden.

With odowda, he was brought in as direct competition for wes burns place in the squad, and took that place, so not hard to see some resentment. 

I personally would have fired lj months ago, but listening back to the radio bristol interview last year, ive never heard anything to say he is as deceitful as is made out in that message. 

Has anyone ever verified that the salary list is genuine, when has anyone ever heard of an a4 list of squad players salary details even being printed by any club ever? 

Just one look at lee tomlin these days should tell you all you need to know, hes in shocking condition. Eddie howe couldnt deal with him, and im sure most on here would agree he is doing a stunning job at bournemouth.

Like i say, i would have fired lj months ago, we are doomed, but what was written is very suspect, and is potentially subject to legal recourse i would imagine.

 

['Orns]

I've got a really busy day going on here

Is it possible that @Never to the dark side can set up a text alert for when Mr Burns comes on and confirms whether he did or did not write the original piece. I've not got all day to sit here waiting

As other people have said, there are a few people on here that I would trust with some behind the scenes info, they aren't hard to spot. PM me if you're in doubt and I'll point them out

I get told a few things, it sounds like a complete absolute shambles. I don't expect anyone to believe me, I'm not ITK, but I know someone who knows someone, who probably knows someone else. Enough has come true that I tend to believe. I was told that LJ wasn't liked a long time ago, so whilst I didn't want to necessarily believe it at the time (I was team LJ until Fulham) there are enough drips coming out now to realise I fell for the dream. That drip is turning into a little more now

**** it, blow it wide open. It can't get much more depressing. Can it? 

[nebristolred]

Yeah I definitely suspect that salary sheet is BS. Footballers salaries are never that simple, they will have all sorts of bonuses and appearance fees. Plus burns' looks incredibly low, 24k a year?!

[Phileas Fogg]

2 minutes ago, nebristolred said:

Yeah I definitely suspect that salary sheet is BS. Footballers salaries are never that simple, they will have all sorts of bonuses and appearance fees. Plus burns' looks incredibly low, 24k a year?!

The salary sheet and the story behind it is true, unbelievably.

[Alessandro]

2 minutes ago, Woodsy said:

I've got a really busy day going on here

Is it possible that @Never to the dark side can set up a text alert for when Mr Burns comes on and confirms whether he did or did not write the original piece. I've not got all day to sit here waiting

As other people have said, there are a few people on here that I would trust with some behind the scenes info, they aren't hard to spot. PM me if you're in doubt and I'll point them out

I get told a few things, it sounds like a complete absolute shambles. I don't expect anyone to believe me, I'm not ITK, but I know someone who knows someone, who probably knows someone else. Enough has come true that I tend to believe. I was told that LJ wasn't liked a long time ago, so whilst I didn't want to necessarily believe it at the time (I was team LJ until Fulham) there are enough drips coming out now to realise I fell for the dream. That drip is turning into a little more now

**** it, blow it wide open. It can't get much more depressing. Can it? 

It's been said before, the players don't need to like the manager, just respect him.

But it looks increasingly like that isn't even the case. However, SL is sticking by LJ.

Is SL buying or fast tracking respect for LJ by backing him and not giving in to some of the players?

I can see a big clear out in the summer, even if we stay up.

[Eddie Hitler]

Let all the poisons that lurk in the mud hatch out.

[BCFChayden]

If it's true there is so much we don't know about the club. You sneaky arrogant *****. No player is better then the club they play for.

[Roger Red Hat]

21 minutes ago, Woodsy said:

**** it, blow it wide open. It can't get much more depressing. Can it?

Agreed.

[MarcusX]

17 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

The salary sheet and the story behind it is true, unbelievably.

Seems odd though because werent we told thta Magnusson wasnt going to get many appearences in his first season but the sheet says 40?

 

[Red-Robbo]

2 hours ago, exAtyeoMax said:

I'm taking this OP with the proverbial pinch of salt, but what really makes me angry is the thought that maybe, possibly we have lost players to undue pettiness of the part of the management. It just reminds of the Paul Hartley debacle.

But if the players concerned were Wes Burns, would he be a guy we want to retain anyway?  More than happy with Tammy,  Djuric and Taylor. 

Didn't Hartley go because his wife wanted to return to Scotland? 

[cider-manc]

41 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

That's HIS opinion. Other opinions are available!

 

It's the part about Oxford were laughing at us that doesn't sit with me....

I work with 3 Oxford fans and they were all gutted when COD left. In fact they said they and most of their mates were more bothered about losing him than Roofe because they believed he would eventually be the better player. They did however say that we had paid for potential and he was far from the finished article and therefore we might have paid too much.

In fact here is an email from one of them when the news broke that we were in for him (i believe I posted it at the time):

"Keep your mitts off him, he's not for sale!!

He bloody awesome and getting better all the time. When he broke into the senior squad a couple of years ago we thought he was a little bit light weight but in the last 2 seasons he's come on leaps and bounds under Appleton's guidance. We want to build our team around him so the gaff really doesn't want to sell him. He was linked with Derby last season but our valuation of him put the off, I believe we want over a million for him if we will even consider letting him go. But yes he fantastic so if he does leave any team that gets him will be better off for it. He just broke into Rep of Ireland senior squad in their last friendly before the Euro's. He didn't go to France but Keane has stated he is in Rep of Ireland's plans for the future so looking like a promising future for the kid."

 

If what the OP has posted was written by Wes Burns dad (and its a BIG if) then it smacks of bitterness. It might be true... But it might be completely made up.

At the time of the supposed salary leak most people on here and social media dismissed it as guess work that was probably close to the mark... Now people are baying for blood and quoting it as gospel! 

To be honest i find it amusing that an anonymous post that basically lists all the rumours of the past 6 months with no actual proof is causing such a commotion. 

 

 

[woodsy62]

1 hour ago, Alessandro said:

 

I think your answer is in MA's interview. 

We are in a relegation fight and the way the club are dealing with it is to stay together, unified.

From inside the club, its Unity. Admirable.

From outside it's stubbornness or losing the plot. Abominable.

The club are staying unified because they think they can keep us up. I don't think that is sinister. Is it the right choice? We will find out in May. Then we will be met with a whole new set of questions if we go down or stay up.

I've said already I think LJ should be unemployed right now. SL is playing one hell of a game of Russian roulette here with the club - it's hell for the fans because we feel like we are being forced to play too, but that's being a football 'fan' these days.

Clearly there has been some fallout this season behind the scenes at times, but I think, although some rumours on OTIB are no doubt close to the truth - this last half a season has reached new heights of hysteria at times. Some very believable fake news. And some real news that has no doubt been exaggerated on OTIB by the vacuum of real information and frustration at our current position.

As for this OP? As @BobBobSuperBob Lots of stuff that could have been gleaned from OTIB and then perhaps embellished. Or maybe a bitter rant from Wes' father? I've also spoken to him and he always seems more eloquent than the OP - plus I'm 99% that although he is a director of a company, it isn't a £450m one.

To be honest I don't think we will have to wait until may look no further than Barnsley home for the season to be over

['Orns]

34 minutes ago, Alessandro said:

It's been said before, the players don't need to like the manager, just respect him.

But it looks increasingly like that isn't even the case. However, SL is sticking by LJ.

Is SL buying or fast tracking respect for LJ by backing him and not giving in to some of the players?

I can see a big clear out in the summer, even if we stay up.

Agree with the first part. We've all been in that position

I don't see how any of this garners any, let alone more, respect for LJ within the 'family'. It just makes him look like SL's pet

A clear out is easier said than done. There are a lot of players on very good money that their performances this season don't make sense for someone else to pick up. How long did we wait for the post GJ clear out when he left? At least two or three seasons as I remember

[NickJ]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Have to say those figures look very suspect, for the simple reason that our wage bill last season (and I don't know what % of it is non playing staff) was in excess of £13m! (That does not include social security, or pension or directors pay either).

The rest of the account sounds very interesting in OP but the wage bill seems crazily low.

 

59 minutes ago, simon uk said:

Has anyone ever verified that the salary list is genuine, when has anyone ever heard of an a4 list of squad players salary details even being printed by any club ever? 

 

 

50 minutes ago, nebristolred said:

Yeah I definitely suspect that salary sheet is BS. Footballers salaries are never that simple, they will have all sorts of bonuses and appearance fees. Plus burns' looks incredibly low, 24k a year?!

If I had written the text in the OP, the one thing I would have deliberately changed would be the salaries, pro rata.

[Red-Robbo]

Why would you even keep a spreadsheet with players' weekly salaries and be toting it around outside the ground?

As an employer,  it makes no sense.

[Major Isewater]

15 hours ago, sportingmad0209 said:

Won't post who sent it, but I'm sure you can draw your own conclusions...

Just thought I'd pass it on. Don't shoot the messenger! *Tin hat on

Not totally coherent, Engval is sooo bad he is in and around The Swedish national team.

I am sure all is not well at City but remain unconvinced by this post.

 

[BobBobSuperBob]

1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Have to say those figures look very suspect, for the simple reason that our wage bill last season (and I don't know what % of it is non playing staff) was in excess of £13m! (That does not include social security, or pension or directors pay either).

The rest of the account sounds very interesting in OP but the wage bill seems crazily low.

What interests me on that alleged ' leak ' more than wages, is the (Projected) appearances column

We know that there has definitely been pre season discussions about who was likely to make what number of appearances (e.g. Hordur) which I've never heard of at a club before , certainly not discussed in the media

So that suggests to me if it's a fake - it's a clever / well thought out one

If authentic 

The (Projected) appearance column is a worry and would raise even more concerns about LJ

ROD as nailed on first choice (46) That went well

Derrick Williams (40) SOLD

Pack (40)

Tomlin (30 ?????)

Wes (20) ?

 

what about Garrita (Projected 10 appearances )

 

They either suggest that LJ changes his views massively and had IMHO some strange opinions

or

* Its a fake

* This is not LJs document / projections (Might be based on discussions but seems to me to be a financial planning document more than anything .................   MAs document anyone ?  )

 

[CyderInACan]

If I was @djb6162 and this genuinely IS his doing, what's the point? Wes was (allegedly) Fleetwood's record signing, they're in the auto spots to replace us and Wes is presumably appreciated and getting regular game time there. Why would you bother? 

[Major Isewater]

As Abraham Lincoln said " don't believe everything you read on the internet " .

[Eddie Hitler]

7 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

Why would you even keep a spreadsheet with players' weekly salaries and be toting it around outside the ground?

As an employer,  it makes no sense.

Papers for a budgeting meeting?  The listing makes sense if you're trying to shape one of your major costs for the year and then see how the projections in terms of games played stand up to scrutiny.  In my companies (as an employee) other cost elements are much more signfiicant than salaries so they're the ones that will get printed out, analysed and reviewed.  In football it's player salaries.  I've worked at companies where certain potentially difficult meetings are held in a neutral venue, such as a coffee house, to take the tension out of the meeting and allow more relaxed and open discussion and I will often bring paperwork.

It's unprofessional certainly to do this with salary data as most organisations are very careful with their confidential data; I would have anonymised it to be on the safe side.

I saw the list at the time but, bar some Championship Manager experience, I wasn't in a position to assess how reasonable it was.  It didn't look wildly off is the best that I can say.

[BobBobSuperBob]

5 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Papers for a budgeting meeting?  The listing makes sense if you're trying to shape one of your major costs for the year and then see how the projections in terms of games played stand up to scrutiny.  In my companies (as an employee) other cost elements are much more signfiicant than salaries so they're the ones that will get printed out, analysed and reviewed.  In football it's player salaries.  I've worked at companies where certain potentially difficult meetings are held in a neutral venue, such as a coffee house, to take the tension out of the meeting and allow more relaxed and open discussion and I will often bring paperwork.

It's unprofessional certainly to do this with salary data as most organisations are very careful with their confidential data; I would have anonymised it to be on the safe side.

I saw the list at the time but, bar some Championship Manager experience, I wasn't in a position to assess how reasonable it was.  It didn't look wildly off is the best that I can say.

Some of the wages are consistent with talk (and not from a direct / close source) I've heard and consistent with what I would have estimated we'd be paying -

[TETBURY MASSIVE]

28 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

Why would you even keep a spreadsheet with players' weekly salaries and be toting it around outside the ground?

As an employer,  it makes no sense.

It happened 100%..... and the question should really be... who was stupid enough to have messed up..... 

[BRISTOL86]

Some of the players on that leaked salary list didn't even play for us! Why would that document ever have been created citing players who were employed at other clubs at the time?